Topics

Information on how to get (and use) an experimental node assignment


k9dc
 


Link is on the status page. 


-k9dc

On Apr 27, 2019, at 11:52, John Azbill <k5nx@...> wrote:

Dave VE7LTD,

  Are you still doing experimental node assignments?  If so what email address can we use to get a experimental node number?

Dave K5NX
_._,_._,_


John Azbill <k5nx@...>
 

Dave VE7LTD,

  Are you still doing experimental node assignments?  If so what email address can we use to get a experimental node number?

Dave K5NX


k9dc
 

On Tue, February 3, 2009 12:24 pm, WD7F - John in Tucson wrote:
How do I configure my node to NEVER accept connections from these rptDir
fake nodes?
You do nothing. No IRLP node will receive calls from any unauthenticated
node, unless specifically modified to do so.


David McAnally
 

On 2/3/09, WD7F - John in Tucson <wd7f@...> wrote:

How do I configure my node to NEVER accept connections from these rptDir
fake nodes?
de WD7F

John in Tucson

Nothing. Only non-experimental IRLP nodes are allowed to connect to your
node, unless you take action to customize your node to allow non IRLP
connections. For example, installing EchoIRLP.

The new optional environment setting, which is not enabled by default, only
allows your node to connect to the experimental IRLP nodes, 0010 - 0099.

There is no built-in option, that I'm aware of, to allow experimental or non
IRLP VoIP systems to connect to your node. Even IRLP reflectors cannot call
your node.

--
Regards,
David McAnally, WD5M


WD7F - John in Tucson
 

How do I configure my node to NEVER accept connections from these rptDir fake nodes?
de WD7F
John in Tucson


 

At 01:35 AM 2/3/2009, you wrote:
Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?



Ie. Can an experimental node connect to ref9617?
Depends on the software used, and yes, the reflector would have to allow the connection. This would have to be designed by the node owner. :)

73 de VK3JED / VK3IRL
http://vkradio.com


wb6ymh
 

--- In irlp@..., Danny Musten <danny@...> wrote:

Can this experimental thread be moved to a special interest group list
and off the main posts?

Danny KD4RAA
Sounds like a good idea. I created a new Yahoo group
experimental_roip for that purpose. All hams are welcome, let the
experiments begin.

Also experimental node 0016 is "on the air" and available for testing.
It's just an ADPCM reflector at the moment, but that will change in
time.

Many thanks to Dave Cameron for taking the time to accommodate those
of us interested in playing with the technology! It's the
experimental aspects of Ham radio has held my interest for the last 30
years.

73's Skip WB6YMH


Jim WW4M
 

IRLP is designed to be a secure system that requires an RF connection
at each end. This is why many people chose to go with IRLP over other
systems. The experimental stuff is for people who want to work outside
of that framework.

Jim WW4M

--- In irlp@..., Jason Stahls <jason@...> wrote:

Danny Musten wrote:
Can this experimental thread be moved to a special interest group list
and off the main posts?
Ok, I'm in no means a position of power around here but I have to ask,
why would you want to do that? I mean I could understand if this
thread
dealt with EchoIRLP, or Asterisk or something but it's specific to IRLP
and how it can now handle experimentation without killing the entire
network...

--
Jason Stahls
VA3JSS


Jason Stahls
 

Danny Musten wrote:
Can this experimental thread be moved to a special interest group list
and off the main posts?
Ok, I'm in no means a position of power around here but I have to ask, why would you want to do that? I mean I could understand if this thread dealt with EchoIRLP, or Asterisk or something but it's specific to IRLP and how it can now handle experimentation without killing the entire network...

--
Jason Stahls
VA3JSS


k9dc
 

It could do that, and I suspect most will be set up that way. But it is purely a function of whatever software is running on the EXP node. IRLP does not produce any software to run as an EXP node, but if you are running rtpDir, Asterisk, Allstar or even the windows version of Speak Freely on a server somewhere, the flags mentioned here earlier will allow your IRLP node to dial into that device, if you want.

There is no security in this arrangement, no guarantee that you are even connecting to Hams, no status page indication, etc. If you or your users are concerned about issues like that, do not set that environment variable. Your node will continue to operate in an IRLP- only secure mode as it always has.

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 12:56 PM, Ramesh Dhami (VA3UV) wrote:
<-- Hi Dave; Does this mean that the EXP node essentially becomes an
open reflector, allowing multiple IRLP nodes to connect to it (with the
proviso that the other IRLP nodes have the Experimental flag set?)

Thanks, Ramesh, VA3UV


Danny Musten
 

Can this experimental thread be moved to a special interest group list
and off the main posts?

Danny KD4RAA


Ramesh Dhami \(VA3UV\)
 

Dave Gingrich wrote:
The experimental flag has no effect on on regular IRLP connections. IRLP nodes can make authenticated connections to IRLP reflectors, just like before. In your case, Reflector 9617 has a foot in IRLP land, and a second foot in Echolink. That is unchanged.
If someone wants to run an Asterisk box as an IRLP reflector, they can apply for a number and then traditional nodes with the Experimental flag set, can make unauthenticated connections to that Asterisk conference.
Bottom line is there is no effect on your operation on 9617.
Experimental boxes do not have PGP keys, therefore they cannot connect to any traditional IRLP reflectors or nodes. This in effect, allows all of the unauthenticated connections in the background with no impact at all, on the existing standard IRLP installations.
<-- Hi Dave; Does this mean that the EXP node essentially becomes an open reflector, allowing multiple IRLP nodes to connect to it (with the proviso that the other IRLP nodes have the Experimental flag set?)

Thanks, Ramesh, VA3UV


Michael J. Wolthuis <wolthui3@...>
 

Perfect, thanks!

Mike





From: irlp@... [mailto:irlp@...] On Behalf Of Dave
Gingrich
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 10:32 AM
To: irlp@...
Subject: Re: [irlp] Information on how to get (and use) an experimental node
assignment



The experimental flag has no effect on on regular IRLP connections.
IRLP nodes can make authenticated connections to IRLP reflectors, just
like before. In your case, Reflector 9617 has a foot in IRLP land,
and a second foot in Echolink. That is unchanged.

If someone wants to run an Asterisk box as an IRLP reflector, they can
apply for a number and then traditional nodes with the Experimental
flag set, can make unauthenticated connections to that Asterisk
conference.

Bottom line is there is no effect on your operation on 9617.

Experimental boxes do not have PGP keys, therefore they cannot connect
to any traditional IRLP reflectors or nodes. This in effect, allows
all of the unauthenticated connections in the background with no
impact at all, on the existing standard IRLP installations.

Does that help?...

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 10:15, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Dave,

I think maybe my question was badly written or I am not
understanding your
response.



Ref9617 is setup for IRLP and Echolink (*MICHIGAN*). Experimental
nodes
should be able to call ref9617 right via their external program
because it
is a reflector??



The difference is I am not referring to my node at all, but the
reflector I
support. Maybe I am confused about what an experimental node
actually can
and can not do.



So, someone is running rtpDir and an experimental node. Can it
connect to
ref9617 which allows for multiple technologies to co-exist?



Mike

Kb8zgl





From: irlp@... <mailto:irlp%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:irlp@... <mailto:irlp%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
Of Dave
Gingrich
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 10:03 AM
To: irlp@... <mailto:irlp%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [irlp] Information on how to get (and use) an
experimental node
assignment



No and No. EXP nodes cannot connect to anything.

Keep in mind, the changes made only allow normal nodes to connect TO
experimental nodes. It does not turn YOUR node in to an experimental
node. That has to be done with external software, rtpDir, Asterisk,
whatever. The experimental nodes operate more like unauthenticated
reflectors.

If someone figures out how to make a call from one of the EXP nodes,
attaching that node to an unauthenticated conference, that is an
illegal cross link, and the keys of the node making that connection
will likely be removed.

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 9:35, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?







------------------------------------

--- IRLP-Owners YahooGroups List ---Yahoo! Groups Links


===========================
Dave Gingrich, K9DC
Indianapolis, Indiana USA
Dave@... <mailto:Dave%40dcg.us>
===========================


k9dc
 

The experimental flag has no effect on on regular IRLP connections. IRLP nodes can make authenticated connections to IRLP reflectors, just like before. In your case, Reflector 9617 has a foot in IRLP land, and a second foot in Echolink. That is unchanged.

If someone wants to run an Asterisk box as an IRLP reflector, they can apply for a number and then traditional nodes with the Experimental flag set, can make unauthenticated connections to that Asterisk conference.

Bottom line is there is no effect on your operation on 9617.

Experimental boxes do not have PGP keys, therefore they cannot connect to any traditional IRLP reflectors or nodes. This in effect, allows all of the unauthenticated connections in the background with no impact at all, on the existing standard IRLP installations.

Does that help?...

-k9dc


On Feb 2, 2009, at 10:15, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Dave,

I think maybe my question was badly written or I am not understanding your
response.



Ref9617 is setup for IRLP and Echolink (*MICHIGAN*). Experimental nodes
should be able to call ref9617 right via their external program because it
is a reflector??



The difference is I am not referring to my node at all, but the reflector I
support. Maybe I am confused about what an experimental node actually can
and can not do.



So, someone is running rtpDir and an experimental node. Can it connect to
ref9617 which allows for multiple technologies to co-exist?



Mike

Kb8zgl





From: irlp@... [mailto:irlp@...] On Behalf Of Dave
Gingrich
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 10:03 AM
To: irlp@...
Subject: Re: [irlp] Information on how to get (and use) an experimental node
assignment



No and No. EXP nodes cannot connect to anything.

Keep in mind, the changes made only allow normal nodes to connect TO
experimental nodes. It does not turn YOUR node in to an experimental
node. That has to be done with external software, rtpDir, Asterisk,
whatever. The experimental nodes operate more like unauthenticated
reflectors.

If someone figures out how to make a call from one of the EXP nodes,
attaching that node to an unauthenticated conference, that is an
illegal cross link, and the keys of the node making that connection
will likely be removed.

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 9:35, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?






------------------------------------

--- IRLP-Owners YahooGroups List ---Yahoo! Groups Links


===========================
Dave Gingrich, K9DC
Indianapolis, Indiana USA
Dave@...
===========================


Michael J. Wolthuis <wolthui3@...>
 

Dave,

I think maybe my question was badly written or I am not understanding your
response.



Ref9617 is setup for IRLP and Echolink (*MICHIGAN*). Experimental nodes
should be able to call ref9617 right via their external program because it
is a reflector??



The difference is I am not referring to my node at all, but the reflector I
support. Maybe I am confused about what an experimental node actually can
and can not do.



So, someone is running rtpDir and an experimental node. Can it connect to
ref9617 which allows for multiple technologies to co-exist?



Mike

Kb8zgl





From: irlp@... [mailto:irlp@...] On Behalf Of Dave
Gingrich
Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 10:03 AM
To: irlp@...
Subject: Re: [irlp] Information on how to get (and use) an experimental node
assignment



No and No. EXP nodes cannot connect to anything.

Keep in mind, the changes made only allow normal nodes to connect TO
experimental nodes. It does not turn YOUR node in to an experimental
node. That has to be done with external software, rtpDir, Asterisk,
whatever. The experimental nodes operate more like unauthenticated
reflectors.

If someone figures out how to make a call from one of the EXP nodes,
attaching that node to an unauthenticated conference, that is an
illegal cross link, and the keys of the node making that connection
will likely be removed.

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 9:35, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?


k9dc
 

No and No. EXP nodes cannot connect to anything.

Keep in mind, the changes made only allow normal nodes to connect TO experimental nodes. It does not turn YOUR node in to an experimental node. That has to be done with external software, rtpDir, Asterisk, whatever. The experimental nodes operate more like unauthenticated reflectors.

If someone figures out how to make a call from one of the EXP nodes, attaching that node to an unauthenticated conference, that is an illegal cross link, and the keys of the node making that connection will likely be removed.

-k9dc

On Feb 2, 2009, at 9:35, Michael J. Wolthuis wrote:

Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?


Michael J. Wolthuis <wolthui3@...>
 

Can experimental nodes be connected to existing reflectors or do the
reflectors have to allow it?



Ie. Can an experimental node connect to ref9617?



Mike

Kb8zgl





From: irlp@... [mailto:irlp@...] On Behalf Of ve7ltd
Sent: Sunday, February 01, 2009 7:08 PM
To: irlp@...
Subject: [irlp] Information on how to get (and use) an experimental node
assignment



Experimental node numbers assignment:

In order to obtain and use an experimental IRLP node number, I
require:

1) Your name
2) Your callsign
3) Your IP address (static) or fully qualified hostname (no-ip.org
etc) **SEE NOTE**
4) What IRLP codec you would like the IRLP nodes that connect to use,
and if full duplex
5) Whether you want DTMF tones to be muted or not.
6) What current IRLP nodes you own or maintain
7) What your planned use of the experimental node is (software used,
etc).

Send this information to experimental@...
<mailto:experimental%40irlp.net> , not to my address.

In return, I will add you to the list of experimental nodes, which is
contained in the exp-x-reference file.

In order to participate in the experimental node system,
participating nodes must add the following flag to their environment
file:

export ALLOW_EXPERIMENTAL_NODES=YES

Nodes who do not add this will get a "node does not exist" when they
try and call.

The IRLP files that have changed or been added:

scripts/decode - added the ability to split out the 0000-0999 as
experimental
scripts/exp-x-reference - the file that contains all the IP/host info
scripts/experimental_call - the script that sets up the calls

These will be automatically updated tonight, or you can manually
force an update.

The call that is made is the same call that is made to the echo
reflector. No verification of the identity of the node, no ping, and
no TCP connection is made.

Limitations -

1) Only one assignment per callsign at first. Once the demand has
been determined, others will be allowed if available.
2) No updates to the entries will be made once set, so verify the
info is correct.
3) There will be no status reporting on the IRLP status page, except
that IRLP nodes will show they are connected to 0010 for example.
4) IRLP reserves the right to remove these experimental assignments
at any time, for any reason
5) No requests for specific numbers - they will be assigned in order.

**NOTE** - If you think that your node's IP will change, get a
dynamic DNS hostname setup. I will not be updating the exp-x-
reference file after setup.

Dave Cameron
VE7LTD


k9dc
 

I have no idea... Sounds like an app_rpt question to me. Please take your question over there.

There is NO SUPPORT for the experimental stuff at all. If it works, great. If it does not, Sorry you will have to fix it yourself. It is just an environment file flag and a couple of scripts. Should easy for the average programmer to figure out.

One other thing users should keep in mind?... all security for these connections is turned off. No key exchange, anyone can connect. Even your grandmother running speak freely on her laptop. No assumption the folks are even Hams. If this bothers you do NOT set the environment flag. You have been warned, heheh.


On Feb 1, 2009, at 21:19, Eric Fort wrote:

why add decode to app_rpt? This and many other functions in app_rpt
seem not to belong there but seem they ought to be done in asterisk
proper and acted upon via the dialplan. Unless I misunderstand
something it would seem proper to leave DTMF unmuted and process the
DTMF using Asterisk.

Eric
AF6EP


On Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 6:02 PM, Randy Hammock <rhammock@...> wrote:
On Feb 1, 2009, at 5:42 PM, Tony Langdon, VK3JED wrote:
5) Whether you want DTMF tones to be muted or not.

If DTMF tones are muted, will the DTMF data still be available via
the
FIFO? chan_irlp does not listen for DTMF tones coming in from a
remote
IRLP node (that I'm aware of), it uses the back channel like a normal
IRLP node.
No TCP, no FIFO ;)
Oh well. Guess I'll have to talk to Jim about adding DTMF decode
capability to the incoming IRLP audio stream so that connecting IRLP
nodes can make Asterisk calls if they so desire (if it does not do
that already). After all, a chan_irlp based IRLP node is not much
different than a normal IRLP node that is connected to a repeater
control except that the app_rpt "repeater controller" has virtually
an infinite number of ports to which it can cross-connect.

--
Randy Hammock KC6HUR
http://kc6hur.net/~rhammock/
http://irlp.kc6hur.net/
If there are no horses in heaven, then when I die, I want to go where
they went.
------------------------------------

--- IRLP-Owners YahooGroups List ---Yahoo! Groups Links


===========================
Dave Gingrich, K9DC
Indianapolis, Indiana USA
Dave@...
===========================


Eric Fort
 

why add decode to app_rpt? This and many other functions in app_rpt
seem not to belong there but seem they ought to be done in asterisk
proper and acted upon via the dialplan. Unless I misunderstand
something it would seem proper to leave DTMF unmuted and process the
DTMF using Asterisk.

Eric
AF6EP

On Sun, Feb 1, 2009 at 6:02 PM, Randy Hammock <rhammock@...> wrote:
On Feb 1, 2009, at 5:42 PM, Tony Langdon, VK3JED wrote:
5) Whether you want DTMF tones to be muted or not.

If DTMF tones are muted, will the DTMF data still be available via
the
FIFO? chan_irlp does not listen for DTMF tones coming in from a
remote
IRLP node (that I'm aware of), it uses the back channel like a normal
IRLP node.
No TCP, no FIFO ;)
Oh well. Guess I'll have to talk to Jim about adding DTMF decode
capability to the incoming IRLP audio stream so that connecting IRLP
nodes can make Asterisk calls if they so desire (if it does not do
that already). After all, a chan_irlp based IRLP node is not much
different than a normal IRLP node that is connected to a repeater
control except that the app_rpt "repeater controller" has virtually
an infinite number of ports to which it can cross-connect.

--
Randy Hammock KC6HUR
http://kc6hur.net/~rhammock/
http://irlp.kc6hur.net/
If there are no horses in heaven, then when I die, I want to go where
they went.


 

At 01:02 PM 2/2/2009, you wrote:

I can probably answer these based on Dave's original post - no, I
can't see how negotiation would take place, as there is no TCP
channel. Would be nice, but not sure how it could be implemented...
A bit limiting but not a show stopper.
Especially for me, as I want to experiment with full duplex reflectors, but the verdict is "it probably won't work" LOL Be nice to be able to negotiate things like codecs and duplex settings... And then simplex nodes could negotiate simplex. :)



5) Whether you want DTMF tones to be muted or not.

If DTMF tones are muted, will the DTMF data still be available via
the
FIFO? chan_irlp does not listen for DTMF tones coming in from a
remote
IRLP node (that I'm aware of), it uses the back channel like a normal
IRLP node.
No TCP, no FIFO ;)
Oh well. Guess I'll have to talk to Jim about adding DTMF decode
capability to the incoming IRLP audio stream so that connecting IRLP
nodes can make Asterisk calls if they so desire (if it does not do
that already). After all, a chan_irlp based IRLP node is not much
different than a normal IRLP node that is connected to a repeater
control except that the app_rpt "repeater controller" has virtually
an infinite number of ports to which it can cross-connect.
I might have to let the DTMF in and use thelinkbox to decode DTMF. :) thelinkbox is similar in that it also has a ridiculous number of ports to interconnect. ;)

73 de VK3JED / VK3IRL
http://vkradio.com